Town Hall, Wednesday July 17, 2002 for approval at the

8/21/02 meeting



Chairperson Bellmer called the meeting to order at 5:00 p.m.


PRESENT:   Chairperson Alvin Bellmer, Planning Commissioners’ Charles Lewis,

                      Michael Van Dyke, Dennis Jochman, Harold Pelton, Kris Koeppe, and

                      Richard Ratchman. Community Development Director George Dearborn

                      and Associate Planner Jeffrey Smith.



ALSO PRESENT:  Cormac McInnis                          

                                 Ed Duessing

                                 Dave Schwartz

                                 Dan Schmidt

                                 Judy Duessing

                                 Dale Nelsen

                                 Pat Kiesow

                                             Kim Charniak

                                             Paul Dahms

                                             Joe Acker

                                             Julie Acker


Approval of Minutes – June 19, 2002


Motion by Chairperson Bellmer, seconded by Commissioner Van Dyke, to approve the minutes of the Planning Commission meeting on June 19, 2002 as submitted. Motion carried unanimously.



1.  Preliminary Plat – Davel Engineering, Inc. – McGann Acres – (008-0516-09)


Director Dearborn discussed some of the details of the new single-family preliminary plat, such as how there will be seven large lots, a new road (McGann Ct.) with a cul-de-sac, and a navigable stream running along the southern boundary. Furthermore, the 75 ft. setback from the navigable stream will be mandated as an environmental corridor, just like the subdivision to the south. In addition, Director Dearborn pointed out that proposed outlot was not desirable to staff and one of the conditions of the plat would be to attach it to the adjacent lot.

Finally, Associate Planner, Jeffrey Smith, explained that the applicant may amend the plat to include the existing Data-Tel shed as an outlot in order to give the proposed Lot 7 more flexibility with square footage for accessory structures.



The conditions for the preliminary plat proposed by Town staff are as follows:


1.      A drainage plan, with calculations, is submitted to the Town Engineer for approval.

2.      An environmental corridor be established along the southern portion of the plat (75 ft. setback), which includes preserving vegetation and trees. A note on the plat shall read as follows: The environmental corridor is intended to preserve the existing brush, vegetation, and trees located within the 75 ft. setback from Millbrook Creek. Cutting and clearing of live brush, tress, or any other vegetation is strictly prohibited and shall be enforced by the Town of Menasha.

3.      The existing garage, located to the south of the proposed Lot 1, will have to be removed since it lies within the 75. ft. shoreland setback.

4.      A utility easement must be shown on the plat to loop water over to Symphony Blvd. The size of the easement will be specified after discussions with Utility staff.

5.      Outlot 1 is attached to the adjacent residential property.

6.      The property is rezoned from A-2 (General Farming) to R-2 (Suburban Single-Family).

7.      Approval of all agencies and all other governmental entities with authority to object to a plat.

Cory McInnis, Davel Engineering, questioned condition #3 (garage removal out of the environmental corridor) since the property owner received a Town building and County Zoning permit for the garage in the past. The Town originally mandated this condition since the nonconforming structure would lie within the 75 ft. setback from the navigable stream. A few Planning Commissioners explained that the permits were probably issued in the past since the stream at that time was probably not considered navigable by the Department of Natural Resources.


Motion by Commissioner Jochman, seconded by Commissioner Pelton, to approve the Preliminary Plat, with the 7 specified conditions.


Commissioner Jochman then amended the motion, to remove condition #3 so staff can further examine the existing nonconforming garage with the applicant. The motion was seconded by Commissioner Pelton. The amendment carried unanimously.


Motion by Commissioner Jochman, seconded by Commissioner Pelton, to approve the Preliminary Plat, with the new 6 specified conditions. Motion carried unanimously.


2.  Variance – Richard Pataska – 1105 Appleton Road – (008-1590)


Director Dearborn explained that the applicant requested a variance to construct an addition to the existing building that would not meet the required B-3 (General Business) 50 ft. street setback. Director Dearborn stressed that staff did not agree with the B-3 street setback requirement but the Town must abide to this as long as it falls under County Zoning.


Director Dearborn then listed the three justifications for a variance (exceptional circumstances, preservation of property rights, absence of detriment) and stated that the proposal did not meet them, especially the exceptional circumstance justification. For instance, this lot was not the only B-3 zoned lot in the area that has a building which was nonconforming to the 50 ft. street setback.


Furthermore, Director Dearborn stated that staff would prefer a rezoning to B-2 (Community Business), which required only a 30 ft. street setback. With this rezoning, the only nonconforming setback would be the existing building on the north side yard setback as opposed to the addition as well on the Clovis Avenue street setback. A variance would still be required but it would be easier to justify with only one nonconforming side for the existing building.


Commissioner Jochman pointed out that the submitted site plan did show the accurate setbacks. Also, Commissioner Jochman clarified that other B-3 lots on Appleton Road did not have buildings which conformed to the 50 ft. street setback requirement.


Chairperson Bellmer restated the fact that if the property was rezoned to B-2, then the only nonconformance would be the north side setback for the existing building. The proposed addition would then be conforming to the B-2 street setback requirement.


Motion by Commissioner Jochman, seconded by Commissioner Lewis, to delay the variance for 60 days in order for staff to discuss alternative options with the applicant, such as a rezoning to B-2. Motion carried unanimously.



3.  Certified Survey Map – Patrick Laux – Goss Ave. 1147 Goss Ave. – (008-0397-04-01, 008-0397-03)


Director Dearborn reported to the Commission that the CSM would adjust the property line and vacate a portion of a mapped 66 ft. road right-of-way. Director Dearborn reminded the Commission that the Goss property was recently annexed to the City of Menasha, which would still be developed as a single-family subdivision. Furthermore, the City of Menasha was not requiring Jennie St. to pass through the subdivision, which was contrary to what the Town desired. Since the road will not pass through, then Town staff can recommend approval of the CSM. But staff would not issue any building permits in this area until the City of Menasha officially recorded the single-family plat.


Chairperson Bellmer clarrifed that the City of Menasha would not require Jennie St. to pass through the new subdivision.


Motion by Chairperson Bellmer, seconded by Commissioner Van Dyke, to approve the CSM, with the condition that the City of Menasha records the single-family subdivision, Gambsky Grove. Motion carried unanimously.

4.  Preliminary Plat – Davel Engineering, Inc. – 2nd Addition to High Plain Meadows – (008-0169[p])


Director Dearborn stated the proposed single-family plat, consisting of 25 new lots, would abut the quarry. Director Dearborn described how the roads were proposed to bulb at the intersection with Golden Field Road. Town staff, including the Street Department, did not prefer this design since it posed maintenance problems. Staff met with the applicant prior to the meeting and decided to keep the bulbed right-of-way but have the road paved at a right-angled corner.


Furthermore, staff would prefer that the drainage and utility easements be separated and clearly identified. Finally, Town staff mandated a fence or some other type of screening to be used adjacent to the quarry.


The conditions for the preliminary plat that were recommended by staff include:


1.    A drainage plan, with calculations, is submitted to the Town Engineer for approval.

2.      The connection of both High Meadows Lane & Deer Prairie Drive to Golden Field Road shall be a right-angled corner and the lots fronting these roads be adjusted to reflect this change.

3.      The easements for drainage & utilities in the rear of lots 78-94 be reversed so that there is a 15’ drainage easement and a 10’ utility easement.

4.      Fencing or some other form of secure barrier shall be placed along the northern portion of the plat that is adjacent to an active quarry.  This will to ensure that access is limited to this property.

5.       Approval of all agencies and all other governmental entities with authority to object to a plat.

Cory McInnis, Davel Engineering, stated that keeping the right-of-way bulbed but paving the road at squared-off corners would allow the plat to have a smaller frontage (33 ft.) for a few lots since cul-de-sac lots have less frontage requirements. This would satisfy the developer (keeping the same amount of lots) and the Town (helps with road maintenance).


Commissioner Pelton clarified that there would be at least a 6 foot fence placed between the subdivision and the Michels quarry property. Director Dearborn emphasized that this screening would have to be a secured barrier.


Motion by Commissioner Jochman, seconded by Commissioner Ratchman, to approve the Preliminary Plat, with the 5 specified conditions. Motion carried unanimously.






5. Town Conditional Use Permit – Consolidated Construction Co. – (008-0224-02)


Director Dearborn explained that the applicant was requesting a Town CUP for a new strip mall and restaurant. The strip mall would have a mixture of retail, restaurant, and office uses. The lot has a navigable stream but the 75 ft. setback did help the proposal easily meet the minimum open space requirement.


The conditions set forth by staff for the Town CUP are as follows:


1.      Fences – There is a 6 ft. opaque fence shown along the northern property line. The specific fence details must be submitted to staff and the Planning Commission may require a higher fence based on resident input.

2.      Outdoor lighting – No outdoor lighting detail is shown.  All outdoor lighting must conform to the requirements of this district (e.g. no wooden poles, full cut-off fixtures)

3.      Signs – No signs have been identified. The design & color of the facial signage for each use in the strip mall shall be uniform. Any free standing signs must abide to the B-5 guidelines and the design and placement shall be approved by Town staff.

4.      Parking – Parking is identified on the plan (233 stalls) and it meets the minimum requirements of this district.  Staff encourages that parking be placed in the rear of the 4,800 sq. ft. building as opposed to fronting W. American Drive. If the parking is placed in the rear, then the building only needs a 30 ft. street setback as opposed to a 60 ft. street setback.

5.      No garages or storage buildings are identified on the site. If proposed, they must abide to the B-5 guidelines. 

6.      Radio and Television Antennas – No antennas are shown on the site plan.  They must be in conformance with the requirements of the B-5 zoning district. 

7.      Satellite Dishes – No satellite dishes are shown on the plan.  They must be in conformance with the requirements of the B-5 zoning district. 

8.      The façade of the strip mall will be a combination of masonry and steel. More details (e.g. color) are required to be submitted to staff in order to ensure that the design would be unique.  At this time, there is not an exterior façade design for the future 4,800 sq. ft. restaurant and these details will then need to be submitted to the Planning Commission for review and approval.

9.      Landscaping – No landscape plan has been submitted.  A plan must be submitted prior to final approval of the plan. This will include landscaping in the parking lot islands and near entrance areas. Also, if the parking stalls for the 4,800 sq. ft. restaurant are not placed in the rear, then landscaping will be required fronting it in order to create an aesthetically pleasing buffer to W. American Drive.

10.  A 10-foot wide asphalt trail shall be constructed along the entire balance of the property fronting West American Drive in order to provide for pedestrian and bicycle flow. Interconnections to all buildings on the site shall be provided to this trail by identified crosswalks and/or physical connections as specified by staff during the detailed site plan review.

11.  There shall be a bike racks at the strip mall and fast food restaurant. 

12.  A detailed site plan review and drainage review shall be conducted by staff as required by town ordinance and approved prior to the issuance of building permits.  This review shall include incorporation of all required general and basic regulations of the B-5 zoning district.

Director Dearborn emphasized the importance of conditions #1 (fence/screening) #8 (façade review) and #10 (10 ft. trail and interconnections to the site).


Paul Dahms, 1296 Alex Ct., stated that he preferred a berm, with at least a 6 foot fence on it in order to address the noise from the proposed project. Also, Mr. Dahms discussed some of the drainage problems in the nearby area and questioned if they would just get worse. Furthermore, Mr. Dahms inquired about the access drives only being on Olde Buggy Drive and Director Dearborn responded by stating that any driveway on W. American Drive would be too close to an intersection. Finally, Mr. Dahms clarified with staff that a sidewalk would be placed on the west side of Olde Buggy Drive.


Dan Schmidt, 1297 Alex Ct., told the Commission that other neighbors on Alex Ct. as well as himself were concerned with potential noise problems from the project. Mr. Schmidt then described some of the current drainage problems in the nearby area, such as basements flooding. Director Dearborn then stated that onsite retention would be required as part of the drainage plan so that the post-construction runoff would not exceed the pre-construction runoff.


Dale Nelsen, Consolidated Construction, described the size and slope of the existing berm on the lot. Mr. Nelsen went on to explain that this berm was not viable for the project since it was too big and therefore, require a lot of maintenance. Mr. Nelsen then felt that a well-designed fence would better address the noise concerns from the adjacent neighbors. Mr. Nelsen later stated that there would be landscaping (placed closer to the residential lots than the fence) used as screening as well as the fence. The developer would intend on preserving as many existing trees as possible. Also, Mr. Nelson stated that the light poles would be lower in order to make the project fit in better with the surrounding neighborhood.


In response to previous drainage concerns, Mr. Nelsen explained that there would be a detention pond in the northeast corner of the lot and furthermore, there would be many internal storm sewers within the parking lot areas. Mr. Nelsen stated that the applicant was willing to put in an extra swale on the north property line to divert existing water to the new detention area. Mr. Nelsen then cautioned the Commission that the drainage details would not be ready until the engineer drafted the drainage/flood study.


Commissioner Van Dyke recommended that the detention pond be placed as far away from the northeast corner of the property.


After examining the proposed conditions of the Town CUP, many Commissioners agreed that some of them should come back to them at a future meeting for approval. For example, the key conditions were the fence, landscaping, design, and drainage.


Motion by Commissioner Lewis, seconded by Commissioner Pelton, to approve the Town CUP, with the 12 specified conditions. Conditions # 1, 8, 9,& 12 will come back to the Planning Commission. Motion carried unanimously.









1.  Comprehensive Plan Update – Intergovernmental Cooperation & Revisit Future Land Use


The consultant for the Town, Jon Bartz, briefly discussed some of the major portions of the intergovernmental element, such as mutual aid agreements and boundary agreements. For example, the Town of Menasha has mutual aid agreements with the Town of Clayton with shared economic development, a possible trail on Hwy. 10, street maintenance and potential utility extensions. Mr. Bartz briefly described some aspects of the boundary agreements with the City of Menasha and City of Appleton.


Mr. Bartz, Planning Commissioners, staff, and members of the audience then posed some visions/ideas for intergovernmental cooperation:



Mr. Bartz then discussed some revisions to the Land Use Element, such as Special Planning Areas now designated as Neighborhood Discussion Areas. Another major revision involved allowing some rural residential development outside of the sewer service area. The stipulations for this were as follows: 1) Only involve lots over 35 acres and can split up to 3 rural residential (maximum of 2 acres) lots. 2) These rural residential lots would require 100 ft. of frontage on a public road. This new proposed policy would only affect a handful of properties in the northwest section of the Town.


Mr. Bartz discussed factors affecting projections for single-family development:



Mr. Bartz discussed factors affecting projections for multi-family development:





Motion by Commissioner Lewis, seconded by Commissioner Ratchman, to adjourn the meeting at 7:55 p.m. Motion carried with 5 Aye; 2 Excused (Comm. Jochman left at 6:05 p.m. and Comm. Pelton left at 6:30 p.m.).


                                                                                   Respectfully submitted,





                                                                                    Jeffrey Smith      

                                                                                    Associate Planner