Submitted for Town Board Approval - 02/22/99




Municipal Complex - Assembly Room

Monday, January 25, 1999



Agendas with resolutions were posted at the Municipal Complex, Fire Station 40, Sanitary District No. 4, Appleton Public Library, Menasha Public Library, and Neenah Public Library.


Town Chair Arden Tews called the regular meeting of the Town Board of Supervisors to order at 6:08 p.m. and led the Pledge of Allegiance.

Clerk Sprague noted the roll as follows:


Arden Tews, Town Chair Jeanne Krueger, Supervisor #1

Jerry Jurgensen, Supervisor #3 Allen Nennig, Supervisor #4

Carlene Sprague, Town Clerk Carl Sutter, Town Engineer

John Claypool, Town Attorney Bogdan "Bob" Vitas, Administrator

Grace Vander Velden, Dir. of Finance George Dearborn, Dir. of Com. Dev.

Gaylene Nash, Asst. to Admin. Don Cox, Fire Chief


Robert Sprague, Supervisor #2


Joe Trudell Bill Acker Rick Irwin

Steve Veldhorst Jim Zucker Lee Neerhof

Corey Lee Alan Ament Pete Guckenberg

Josh Guckenberg Todd Shadick Ron Rehbein

Virgil Noordyk Mary Rehbein Jim Gray

Robert Francart Jim Guckenberg Harold Pelton

Martha W. Andrew Blake Barrett Chuck Lewis

Richard Ratchman Char Steenis Fred Steenis

Evie Guckenberg Jeni Steenis Russ Handevidt

Michael Lettier Kent Knaack Mark Steenis



Presentation – Winnebago County Committee on Aging – "File of Life"

Martha Andrew, representing the Winnebago County Committee on Aging, presented the "File of Life" identification which she stated is available to all senior Residents of Winnebago County free of charge.

Martha Andrew explained to the Town Board and Town Residents that this is a life-saving program targeting senior citizens. It is sponsored by the Winnebago County Committee on Aging. The medical information card has special conditions, medical problems, allergies, medications, etc. When medical personnel come to their assistance, first responders can respond appropriately. Northern TRIAD, Sheriff Brooks, Steve Harman, Sheriff’s Department and George Parto. They are targeting senior citizen locations, such as the winter safety carnival.

Clerk Sprague stated that she would like to offer this program at the Spring Election polling places and would like this to be printed in "The Bridge" newsletter.



Chief Cox spoke as a Resident and circulated a petition, nominating Leon Grundman, a volunteer fire fighter for 40 years, for the Post-Crescent "Janet Berry Volunteer of the Year".



Duck Hunting, Stroebe Island – Chuck Lewis

(The following section is the discussion that occurred. It was transcribed from a tape as accurately as possible.)

Chairman Tews, "Chuck, would you like to start off, we’ve got your name on here."

Chuck Lewis, "Chuck Lewis, 2167 Woodlawn Lane. I don’t know how much you haven’t heard on this subject yet, and I’m going to restrict my remarks this evening to some serious inaccuracies in the reporting in the Post-Crescent of that October 12 meeting where the petitions were presented and in particular, and I questioned the Post-Crescent vigorously on this, the statement in the article that said, and this is referring to Mr. Knaack, "presented a petition containing 56 names, most island residents, who favor allowing hunting to continue." Well, I couldn’t figure out quite where all those people might be, so I got a copy of the petition from the Town offices, I also had to get a copy and pay for it of our own petition because I had turned in the only one that I had a copy of. And I just want to give you a couple numbers here. Our petition against hunting that Richard Ratchman, who will be speaking shortly, got names and signatures for, contains 56 Residents of Stroebe Island. There happened to be one that lived in that condo tower. And when I went through the, this map here as an analysis of the other petition, because I had to find out where all these people were, what it came down to out of the 56 names, there were actually 27 Stroebe Island Residents. Of that 27, there were 9 signatures of people who were actually marsh owners, which left then a net of, on Stroebe Island, 18 Residents favoring the duck hunting. The remainder, there were 22 that were on North Lake and Butte des Morts Beach Road, there were, I think, 7 family members, owners, on Butte des Morts Beach Road. The remainder were so far down Butte des Morts Beach Road, I doubt if they could even hear the guns go off, in fact, several were North Lake, which is down past 441. And the remaining 7 were spread all over the whole Fox Valley, so I don’t think that they would have had, they were sympathetic to the petition, I can understand, but in the final analysis, there were 56 signatures on the petitions that we had obtained, on Stroebe Island, and there were 27 at best which included 9 of the family members. So, I just wanted to clarify that. I tried very hard to get the Post-Crescent, I supplied them the map, I supplied other material because I thought that was, this is an opinion, this isn’t conjecture, these are facts, these are names, and there were pieces of petitions that weren’t obtained and they did manage to make quite a case for Supervisor Krueger signing the wrong petition, which I thought was kind of interesting, because she’s the one who had voted against it before. So, it’s gotten to be quite a can of worms, and all I’m trying to do is reinforce the idea that it was about a three to one in favor of discontinuing hunting, and I want to say also that we only covered 1/3 of the island – that part that is closest to the marsh area. So that’s my, I hope that we can get this resolved one of these days, because I have to warn you that if we have any trouble, I’m going to have to call Monica Lewinsky to testify on our behalf, so just be…"

Chairman Tews, "Anyone else that would like to speak on this? This is a discussion item only and we've gone through this several times, but we want to make sure that everybody who’s here and at one time. Anyone else who would like to speak on this issue? Yes, way in the back."

Char Steenis, "Char Steenis, I live at 2175 W. Butte des Morts Beach Road. I’m here representing myself and my husband who had to leave a few minutes ago for employment. I wanted to address the noise issue, but first of all I want to make reference to the petitions that Mr. Lewis was just talking about. I believe when a petition is done for a community, it is not essential for all the Residents who are signing the petition to live in the area affected. I might be wrong on that but I think that is accurate. If you are doing it for a Town ordinance, it does not have to be in the area that is being affected. Is that true, Mr. Claypool?"

John Claypool, Town Attorney, "The petition has no real legal affect one way or the other. It’s just a statement of the Residents. It has no legal affect one way or the other."

Char Steenis, "So it is not structured so as to just be inclusive only of the area affected, it can be anybody that lives in the township."

John Claypool, "Right, there is no…" Char Steenis, "I know there is no legal binding on it, I understand that, is that true though that anyone in the Town can sign it?"

John Claypool, "Given the fact that there is no legal authority for the creation of a petition like this, in answer to your question, I guess, yes, but…" Char Steenis, "Thank you." John Claypool, "The point is it’s a non-legal issue."

Char Steenis, "I know that, I understand that, I just wanted to make that clear because that was stressed strongly. Okay, now to my noise issue. Since that was one of the points that Mr. Lewis just brought up. First of all, who says there is too much noise? What is noise to one person may not be disturbing to another person. And how do you measure noise? There are laws on the books that prevent noise above a certain decibel reading. Now, is the issue, the noise issue, the true issue or is it just a cover for animal rights people who want to stop hunting in general. Perhaps it is not the noise that is the problem but rather the dead ducks. Are we, in fact, facing some anti-hunters using a back-handed sneak attack at stopping a state and federally approved activity? It’s the wrong time of the year, but think of the noise made by personal watercraft and high-powered speedboats. Not the yachts or pleasure boats. Keep in mind that duck hunting occurs for only a few weeks out of the year. The watercraft and speedboats are in use for a minimum of four months. And then we have the trains and the planes that are every day of the year. To solve the conundrum, we demand that decibel reading tests are done at the home of the complainants while shotguns are fired from the areas normally used during duck hunting season. Also, decibel reading tests could be done at the homes of the hunters. That is where the readings would be undoubtedly the loudest. In addition, decibel reading tests need to be done of the train and plane noises to clarify this aspect of the noise issue even further. When the decibel readings have been done, we will then have some concrete evidence to prove or disprove the noise complaint. Thank you."

Chairman Tews, "Thank you. Anyone else? Yes, sir."

Richard Ratchman, "Richard Ratchman, 209 Stroebe Road, Stroebe Island. As Chuck and I canvassed our neighbors who are impacted about the hunting on the south end of the island, from our petition, as we listened to our neighbors on the south end of the island, we clearly indicate that we would like to see the discharging of firearms completely stopped in our neighborhood. The future safety is certainly a critical concern of ours. As we listen to our Town professionals about this issue, this concern again is echoed and I’d like to read certain comments from a memorandum by Mr. William Weiss that was directed to all Town Board members about this subject. I’ll just review certain short excerpts from this. In one part, it states, "In reality, within a 25-year period, everything changed except the right to discharge a firearm/hunt in a residential area. Up and down the Fox River, throughout the Fox Cities, restrictions have been placed on the discharging of weapons, except on this small pocket. As we all are aware of, the tremendous changes that have occurred in the last quarter of century. We are now a full-fledged residential area of over 175 residences, safely estimating approximately 350 or more people who come and go across the causeway each and every day." The very bottom, "We as a community cannot continue to live in the past or change our philosophical beliefs on a weekly basis. Hunting in the marsh has come and gone. We need to restrict the discharge of firearms in the remainder of section 3 and move on to more relevant issues of importance related to the next millennium. Please take into serious account our neighbors and your Town professionals concerning this issue."

Chairman Tews, "Anyone else?"

Kent Knaack, "Kent Knaack, I live at 2201 Woodlawn Lane. For the last 10 years nothing has changed out on the island. There has been 175 residents or whatever you just said, living out there, and they got all the state laws and everything about hunting so far from roads and houses. We’ve been over this a hundred times. I don’t really have nothing else to say. I don’t know how many times we can keep coming back here bringing this issue up, you know, it’s a bunch of … Waste of time for you guys and us. As far as the state laws and federal regulations go, we’re all within the laws and everybody’s safe and nobody’s got nothin’ to worry about. Thank you."

Chairman Tews, "Anyone else? One more here? Peter?"

Peter Guckenberg, "Peter Guckenberg, 2285 W. Butte des Morts Beach Road. Let me address just the safety issue. There’s a few things that were brought out the last time. One was about a gentlemen who said that a person passing on a bicycle with a gun in a case, okay, and the gun was pointed at him and he has a little child in a carriage or something, made a big dramatic point about it that that was a safety issue. Well, the gun in the case is a legal way to carry a weapon according to the State of Wisconsin, okay? If you want to go that route, then every time a car goes by that has a gun in a case, it could be pointing at me if I’m walking along the road, okay? The other thing is safety issues. What’s changed in the marsh since 1990? Other than me building my home from one end of our property to the other. Nothing has changed. In 1990 at least two of the present Board members were out there. We had all the issues addressed then and there wasn’t a safety concern then, so what’s changed? Why is it a safety concern now? The island had already been saturated by homes, we as our land owners we have not sold or changed our lands. The Town should not consider the opinions of some disgruntled outside hunters, who we as land owners will not allow to trespass on our property. No, I have never threatened to shoot anybody and I’ve never shot at anybody. These remarks were directed to impact the Board into believing that the marsh was unsafe. If the marsh is unsafe because there is inhabitable water, then every piece of inhabitable water in the State of Wisconsin that people hunt in is unsafe and that is not true. We as landowners are safe hunters. Our actions pose no safety threat to the island. Has there been accidents? There hasn’t been any accidents. Are the real underlying issues gun control? You don’t want to hear the guns go off because we have a gun. People feel uneasy in their homes. Animal rights issues, don’t hurt the poor ducks. Or simply the fact that we own the property and we can use it as we see fit. Thank you."

Chairman Tews, "Anyone else? One more yet?"

Mark Steenis, "Mark Steenis, 2175 W. Butte des Morts Beach Road. This gentleman back here, I forget your name, he made the comment that since things have built up and everything, the noise and things like that have been problems and that that should be shut down. Well, if people go out and build up out around the farms out in the country, are they going to stop farmers from putting manure on their fields because it smells bad? No, because the farmers want to manure on their fields, it doesn’t cost them anything. The hunting is a good source for our families to get food, it’s not harming anybody. As Peter said, issues have been addressed as far as the safety, things haven’t changed, so why should we be shut down now?"

Chairman Tews, "Anyone else? Board members?"

Supervisor Nennig, "Mr. Chairman, I’ll make a motion that we send out a post card survey to just the members, people that live on the Island, asking them whether they are against hunting or for it or undecided…two part, I think it’s in back, have staff do that."

Unidentified from audience…"Can you speak up a little bit?"

Supervisor Nennig, "Yes, I am suggesting that we send out a postcard survey, ask people if they are for hunting, against it or undecided, don’t care, whatever, and just send it out to the residents of Stroebe Island which it affects the most, and see what kind of a survey we get."

Unidentified from audience…."The issue should not be though because if the people don’t like hunters in general they are going to say I don’t want hunting."

Supervisor Nennig, "I realize that" Unidentified from audience…."but if _____Beach Road, the people that live along there, what about the rest of the Town of Menasha?"

Supervisor Nennig, "Well, it don’t affect…" continued talking from audience…Chairman Tews, "Wait a minute, let Al finish here". Supervisor Nennig, "I don’t feel it affects the rest of the Town of Menasha, maybe some along Butte des Morts Beach Road where Peter lives himself for instance, uh, Peter Guckenberg, but a, I don’t believe you gotta go way down to the……talking from audience….I don’t think you gotta go down to Lake Street or anything like that."

Chairman Tews, "Your recommendation is that we send out a postcard to all the residents on the Island?….Supervisor Nennig, Some on Butte des Morts Beach Road there….Chairman Tews, some on West Butte des Morts Beach Road up to the sewage plant…Supervisor Jurgensen, area where the hunting is done….talk from audience….Chairman Tews, well that’s…(interruption) unidentified - and land owners.

Supervisor Krueger, "I’ll second it but I do have a question, I have been trying to get your attention I do have a question. This is for Pete and Char, You brought it up about hum, Pete, about people who against cruelty for animals, is there a reason you brought that up? Did someone say something to you about that, one of the Board members or one of the citizens?"

Pete Guckenberg, it happened a number a years ago…….Supervisor Krueger, oh it happened in………(interruption) -.Pete Guckenberg, most of the time people who don’t live on the Island…Supervisor Krueger – o.k. cause this is the first I have ever heard of, you know, this Peta, o.k, so a number of years ago someone brought this up to you, more than one person, o.k. thanks.

Russ Hanedviet, "With regards to Al’s suggestion of a postcard survey, it is a Town ordinance you are talking about and I really question how you are can write an ordinance based on a select few people, it would have to be a survey for the entire Town if you are going to make a survey and you must survey the entire Town for a law that affects the entire Town, just an opinion."

Talk from Supervisors….unclear…Supervisor Jurgensen, "No, I didn’t",

Supervisor Krueger, "I did, I seconded it"

Supervisor Jurgensen, got a second

Chairman Tews, who didn’t speak yet that has their hand up?

Supervisor Krueger, he spoke

Supervisor Jurgensen, I think we have to take a look at the ordinance

Jim Guckenberg, "Jim Guckenberg, 2199 W. Butte des Morts Beach Road, a just two issues I have since it’s all been talked about, um the land has not been developed, the people that are complaining about the noise or whatever, don’t own the land, really don’t have the right to tell us what we can do on our land and as another issue that Twin City Rod and Gun Club, we started the shooting sporting clays range out there and they built a lot of houses up around there, the shooting didn’t stop because they didn’t like the noise, because they were there first. So I think one of the main issues the Town has to look at here is to support the land owners who own the land not those that move out and decide they want to change the countryside and make it look like a City, thank you."

Question from audience….garbled

Supervisor Nennig, "Well it would give us some idea how the people feel, right now I’m hearing, a I don’t know what to believe."

Chairman Tews, "O.K. Chuck"

Chuck Lewis, "The fact that this is a Town ordinance is a ____, it just happens to apply to a very small plot of territory, and area next to Stroebe Island, so why would the whole Town would have to be, this is something that affects direct area not the entire Town then I guess you would want to get a feeling from, I think the idea is very good then you have a chance to…garbled…people telling us to keep it in a restricted area and not looking for others, so, I think a survey of just the entire Island would be very good indeed.

Chairman Tews, "One more hand back, right straight back here."

Supervisor Krueger, "He spoke already."

Unidentified….."I just have one more thing to say, then a mail survey wouldn’t that change into an opinion thing vs: a fact issue?"

Supervisors, That’s what it is, that’s what we got right now."

Martha Andrew, "Martha Andrew, 978 Pages Point, I disagree um, I believe it should be Town wide, the reason is I live on the East side of Little Lake Butte des Morts, quite a distance from Stroebe, yet I am very much aware of the sound of gun fire, does it bother us? Um, the sound carries across the pond as we all know so we on the East Side of Little Lake butte des Morts are affected and I believe that a Town Ordinance which affects the Town’s people should be made available to everyone and I’d like to ask the Town Board or statistician, um, generally speaking what kind of percent of return do you get on surveys that are mailed out, the percentage?"

Chairman Tews, "George, 15?"

George Dearborn, "We get, a 10 to 15%."

Chairman Tews, "10 to 15%."

Bob Vitas, "Statistically that’s considered reliable."

Chairman Tews, "I would just like to make a comment, we’ve gone through this over a number of years and I have sat up here quite often hearing this and what makes it really tough is we are working with two good groups of people and that’s what makes it really tough. That is a compliment to all of you, no matter if you are for or against, it makes it difficult and tough and I remember back when we built our house and there wasn’t any houses out there but a few of ours and hunters would go along the ditch and shoot, the same ditch that ends up in Little Lake Butte des Morts over there, but eventually over a period of time it ceases because it was getting close to home, so I understand the whole situation but, like I say, it’s really tough because we’re working with two groups of sound citizens. Jerry?"

Supervisor Jurgensen, "Well, we have gone over this a number of times, right now our opinions, you got two opinions and we’re not really getting anywhere, and we are trying to get off dead center here and I don’t know if you did do the survey and you did just Stroebe Island itself and go down Butte des Morts, the affected area, uh, you know, give us a better guideline of the feeling of the people. We know what the feeling is on both sides, but we don’t know how much is over here and how much is there and we’re right in between this thing. So…"

Chairman Tews, "What’s your feeling?"

Supervisor Krueger, "Um, well, that he brought up the postcard etc. See I first became aware of this problem, um, three years ago when I moved on the Island and my neighbor Richard Damrow told me that there were shots in his house from the guns and then they quit, well you may ask him, he told me this and I don’t think he’d lie. And then they quit hunting on that part of it after there were complaints so they went to the other, or the ….audience interruption… excuse me ______________ Chairman Tews, "Hold it – okay Jeanne, continue." Supervisor Krueger continue, "And that was when I first became aware of it is what I am telling you. Then up and down the streets people complained, asked me if I could do something about it, at that time I was the Clerk, I could do nothing about it."

Chairman Tews, "Ok, couple short comments here, and then we are going to move on here. Chuck, we will go right down."

Chuck Lewis, "If it would help, we covered about a 1/3 of the Island and we got 80% return favoring discontinue hunting. Now, if you want to take you off the hook and if you want us to go back out and get the rest of the Island I would rather not do that, um, if you’re worried about the return on the survey, I think you would get quite a significant return from that. If you really want to put this to bed, which I think is really what needs to be done, then I guess we can go out and survey the rest of the Island, and I think another argument or question about whether it should be done through the whole Town or just that area you hear the land owners as saying that (Supervisor Nenning is overheard saying that his motion is seconded and on the floor) it is their property and that they are not going to let anybody on even though they can come in by water, there we are also looking at it restricting it to just that immediate area, so that people in that immediate area should be the ones, because they’re the ones that are affected, they’re the ones who are afraid to go onto the Causeway or down the street that I live on with their children because of the gunfire."

Chairman Tews, "Couple more here yet."

Unidentified…"Just a couple of questions. These people that are complaining, are they educated about guns? Or do they know nothing about them! If they knew more, they might not have so many problems. Also, what is the specific problem here? Is it just hunting or is it the safety issue, you need to inform us more on what the problem is so we can figure out a solution."

Chairman Tews, "I saw one more hand yet, up here."

Unidentified…"It reminds me that Chuck and I would not be here this second evening if we would have only received several signatures…Part of our reason for going and getting involved with the petition was to see if people have similar thoughts as we do about the petition. And our petition clearly indicated that they certainly do. And that’s what the petition is all about.

Unidentified…"Yeah, I think this does affect the whole Town, I have friends and relatives around the whole Town that I invite out there to come hunting. And it does affect hunting and it affects more than just the immediate area."

Unidentified…"If you allow them to go around and present their case to every citizen or Resident on the Island, than we ought to be able to go along with them too and present our case."

Chairman Tews, "I think the more, the best solution would be, like Al says with the postcard so it would be non-biased and people could give their honest, personal opinion, that’s what I feel."

Supervisor Krueger, "A motion has been made and seconded."

Chairman Tews, "A motion has been made and seconded that we have a survey, a card survey, a postcard survey on the Island and the residents on West Butte Beach Road up to the Sewage Treatment Plant. O.K., got that?"

Clerk Sprague, "I just have a question, can we make a motion for…"

Attorney Claypool, "You are just looking for input, you are looking for direction, you’re not acting on anything, you are just looking for input. This is an informal vote to gather information and make a decision, but you might want to clarify how the question is going to read now at this point."

Supervisor Krueger, "The postcard survey shall be sent out to the residents of Stroebe Island and West Butte des Morts Beach Road stopping at the Sewage Plant."

Unidentified, "Can you legally exclude the rest of the Town of Menasha residents? If not, I would suggest that you make those postcards available for every Town resident either here at the Municipal Complex or the Police Department vs: deliberately excluding the rest of the Town of Menasha Residents."

Supervisor Krueger, "This is only a survey and that would be way too expensive."

Attorney Claypool, "This is not a legal issue again, this Board is simply looking for input, they can ask the whole Country if they want or they can ask two people, it is up to them. They are simply asking for input, how they want to do it is up to them, but I would suggest that you at least clarify how the question is going to read at this point. There is no legal requirement how to do it, it is up to you."

Chairman Tews, "We’d probably have two or three questions on there?"

Supervisor Nenning, "Are you against hunting, for hunting or you don’t care."

Supervisor Jurgensen, "With a place for a comment."

Supervisor Nenning, "Yes, with a place for a comment, very good."

Chairman Tews, "Are you to continue the hunting in the Stroebe Island area, are you opposed it, are you for it…"

Supervisor Krueger, "Or you could start out with Shall…"

Chairman Tews, "Bob?"

Administrator Vitas, "Maybe are you in favor or against the Town allowing the discharge of weapons in section 3 of the Town south of Strobe Island, Causeway and the Marsh? That’s really what this issue is, be very, very specific because it is not a question of hunting or not hunting because then you will get your animal rights, it’s a question of your ordinance, your ordinance is what is being challenged by both groups. You have a group that is supporting the ordinance as it is written and has been written for many years and you have a group that wants you to amend the ordinance so you have to be specific. What is your ordinance and what can you control or not control? You can control the discharge of weapons and that is what really the question should go to. I wouldn’t touch the issue of whether they are killing possums out there or ducks or any of that. You want clarification on what the majority sentiment and majority opinion is so that by adoption of your ordinance you know that the majority supports whatever action this Town Board takes and in that way you have done your job. That is your obligation."

George Dearborn, "Mr. Chairman I just wanted to point out that to make it a valid survey, I would recommend that one survey be issued per property owner that makes it a valid statistical sample, otherwise if we are going to do it by Residents within the development, that’s a figure we cannot effectively determine. That is normally how they are done, is by household and when you receive a valid sample back of 10 or 15% then that is a valid, statistical way to do it."

Chairman Tews, "And George what do you usually allow, about 30 days for the return?"

George Dearborn, "No, typically 15 to 20 days tops, after that you don’t get any back."

Chairman Tews, "And bring it back at the first meeting in March?"

Administrator Vitas, "They could mail them in."

George Dearborn, "The normal way would be, if you really want a good response is a postage paid return self addressed envelope. We’ve done them before. They work well."

Chairman Tews, "George, can we do this so we can get this on the Agenda in March, or is that too early?"

George Dearborn, "March, sure we can do it by then."

Supervisor Krueger, "That would be March the 8th."

George Dearborn, "I believe we can do it by then."

Administrator Vitas, "There’s time. We have time enough to prepare a sample card that the Board can authorize being released. And I would prefer that."

Chairman Tews, "All right, a couple, a few more hands here."

Russ Handevidt, "With regards to the up to the Sewage Plant survey, I personally think if you __________taking it down to at least where Main Street starts which is the Polish Connection (The Bridge). I feel with the duck hunters myself, personally there is a duck hunting season they park right out in front of my house, I have to give them instructions what they can do, what they can’t do, where they go, what they do things of this nature. You definitely can hear the shooting from our house, you can hear past, south of the Polish Connection so residents along Butte des Morts Beach Road have a more major affect

or are affected by it more so than what you are giving credence to. I think that’s very, very…not to include people along the lake there and really as sound as the issue really seems to be then people on the other…"

Supervisors…."No, there are other issues here."

Supervisor Krueger, "Safety."

Chairman Tews, "All right, a couple more, one at a time here."

Unidentified….."Could the card have a third box saying ‘I don’t care’?"

Supervisors, "We are."

Administrator Vitas, "It would say For, Against, Undecided."

Supervisor Jurgensen, "Russ, you said down to where Lake Street is, cause there are those homes on Butte des Morts that go all the way down towards Fritse Park, all the way down to Fritse Park, but you are saying…"

Russ Handevidt, "I’m saying at least to the bridge, cause that is technically where North Lake Street starts at Butte des Morts Beach Road ends right at the bridge. That’s what I’m saying, you, I have passed the bridge visiting friends that live down there, and you can easily hear the guns go off."

Chuck Lewis, "I can certainly appreciate…noise, but…a great number of people felt that the safety position that they are afraid to walk down the street near the marsh, so there are different reasons, but safety is one of them. I don’t think people down past the Sewage Plant are in danger of getting hit by a loose shot so I don’t think that is a valid area to include in the survey."

Supervisor Krueger, "Well, it is going to be the discharge of firearms, period."

Chairman Tews, "Way in back."

Unidentified, garbled "…I just want to address what Chuck just said, he just negated the noise issue by what he just said, and yet previously he was addressing the noise issue."

Chuck Lewis, "I’m sorry, I said it was both."

Chairman Tews, "Al, is that your motion – up to.."

Supervisor Nennig, "Make it up to the bridge then."

Supervisor Krueger, "Yes, up to the bridge."

Chairman Tews, "I have a motion and second that the survey on West Butte des Morts Beach Road goes up to the bridge. All in favor, motion carries 4-0." (Supervisor Sprague Absent)



980928-8: Conditional Use Permit – Lehrer LLC dba/Stone Ridge Estates – N of Hwy. 150 and County "O" (008-0576-03-01)

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the conditional use permit, with the additions of "4. Screening with a solid 6 foot fence and to submit a landscaping plan for approval of the Planning Commission and the Town Board. 5. Site plan review shall be required as specified by the Town which will include a drainage plan meeting all Town and County requirements. The landscaping plan is to include green trees at least 8 feet tall to screen all the balconies and the northwest corner of the lot on three sides." Motion failed by a vote of 3-1, with Supervisor Sprague excused. Jurgensen, Nennig and Tews voted NO. Krueger voted YES.

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to amend the conditional use permit to reduce the plan by one unit. Motion failed by a vote of 2-2, with Supervisor Sprague excused. Krueger and Nennig voted NO. Jurgensen and Tews voted YES.

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the conditional use permit, amending to add that one building will have 6 units instead of nine and adding conditions 4 & 5. Motion carried by a vote of 3-1, with Supervisor Sprague excused. Krueger, Nennig, and Tews voted YES. Jurgensen voted NO.

Supervisor Jurgensen stated that there are problems regarding the density that need to be addressed.

Ron Rehbein, Town Resident, apologized for comments he made at the Planning Commission Meeting. He stated that he did not believe this project was compatible with the other residential property owners.

Todd Shadick, Town Resident, stated that the Town Board asked that he would meet with Mr. Lehrer prior to this meeting; however, he called only three days before the meeting. He requested that Mr. Lehrer reduce the number of units built on the property.

Travis Lehrer responded, stating all the conditions he had agreed to comply with regarding the building of these units. He stated that he dropped the density a couple of times, addressed and agreed to all the issues that were asked of him. He had the plans redrawn four times and adjusted to all concerns asked of him. He spent tens of thousands of additional dollars to comply with all requests.

Much discussion ensued.

981214-2: Rezoning – Anthony Utschig – 760 Valley Road (008-1508-01, 008-1509)

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Krueger to approve the rezoning. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

981214-3: Conditional Use Permit – Anthony Utschig – 760 Valley Road (008-1508-01, 008-1509)

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Krueger to approve the conditional use permit, with the following conditions: (1) adequate parking for the existing apartments and the attorney’s office shall be identified on a site plan, (2) all applicable Town, County, State and Federal Codes shall be complied with for the conversion of the existing apartment to office use, and (3) signage shall be identified on the site plan and shall consist of one sign located on the entrance to the office only. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



A. 990125-1: Certified Survey Map – Richard Cleveland Jr. – 941 Appleton Road (008-1569, 008-1570)

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the certified survey map. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

990125-2: Certified Survey Map – Kevin Kadlec – 1055 Jacobsen Road (008-4787, 008-4788)

Chairman Tews abstained from this vote and passed the gavel to Supervisor Jurgensen.

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the certified survey map. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused and Chairman Tews abstaining.

Supervisor Jurgensen passed the gavel back to Chairman Tews.

C. 990125-3: Certified Survey Map – Michels Pipeline – 1433 East Shady Lane (008-0229)

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Krueger to approve the certified survey map. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

D. 990125-4: Certified Survey Map – Pheifer Brothers Construction – 1977 American Drive (008-0249-03, 04, 04-01, 05)

This resolution was withdrawn.

990125-5: Final Special Assessment Construction of Olde Buggy Drive Extension

Town Engineer Carl Sutter stated that the agreement would be separate from the special assessment.

Administrator Vitas agreed, stated that the special assessment would be on a per owner basis. Administrator Vitas recommended that this resolution be referred to the February 8, 1999 meeting.

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Jurgensen to refer this resolution to the February 8, 1999 meeting. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

F. 990125-6: Bid Award – Street Department – 41,000 GVW Cab & Chassis & Related Equipment

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Jurgensen to approve the bid award for the single axle model 2554 International Cab and Chassis to Packer City International for a price not to exceed $51,550 and the Related Equipment to Monroe Truck Equipment for a price not to exceed $44,628. Chairman Tews requested a roll call vote. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

G. 990125-7: Bid Award – Street Department – 15,000 GVW Cab & Chassis & Related Equipment

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Jurgensen to approve the bid award for the Cab and Chassis to Bergstrom Chevrolet, Neenah, with a bid not to exceed $22,636 and the Related Equipment to Monroe Truck Equipment for a price not to exceed $15,830. Chairman Tews requested a roll call vote. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

H. 990125-8: Bid Award – Street Department – Loader/Backhoe Tractor

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Jurgensen to approve the bid award to Service Motor, Dale, with a bid not to exceed $31,335. Chairman Tews requested a roll call vote. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

I. 990125-9: Bid Award – Fire Department Pagers

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the award bid for ten (10) replacement pagers for the Fire Department to Bay Com, Inc., for a cost not to exceed $4,320. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

J. 990125-10: Personnel Policy Amendment – Chapter 20, Holidays

Administrator Vitas explained that this was being amended to give Department heads the discretion of waiving this when appropriate.

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Jurgensen to approve the recommendation of the Personnel Committee to amend Chapter 20, Section B, of the Town’s Personnel Policy to include this added language, effective upon passage. Clerk Sprague requested a roll call vote. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

K. 990125-11: Lamers Transportation Agreement – Amendment

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the contract amendment effective March 1, 1999. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

L. 990125-12: 1998 Year-end Budget Transfers

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to authorize the Director of Finance to make the referenced budget transfers in the 1998 budget. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

M. 990125-13: 1999 Budget Transfer – Law Enforcement/General Gov’t

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Jurgensen to authorize the Director of Finance to execute this transfer of funds. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

990125-14: 1999 Budget Transfer – Law Enforcement Contract Services

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to authorize the Director of Finance to execute this transfer of funds. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

O. 990125-15: Expenditures

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to approve the expenditures with the exception of none. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



A. 990111-1:ORD An Ordinance to Recodify the Municipal Code of the Town of Menasha as to All New, Amending and Repealing Ordinances Adopted in the Year 1998, and All Years Preceding 1998, and All Ordinances Adopted, Amended or Repealed to Date SECOND READING & ADOPTION

MOTION: Supervisor Krueger, second Supervisor Jurgensen to accept the second reading and adopt the ordinance. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



A. 990125-1:RES Resignation – Fire Fighter

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Krueger to approve the resignation of Fire Fighter Tim Hagen with regret. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

B. 990125-2:APP Appointment – Fire Fighter

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Jurgensen to approve the appointment of Jonathon Zimmer to the position of paid-on-call fire fighter with Station #41, effective January 26, 1999. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



Special Meeting of the Town Board – 12/14/98

Regular Town Board Meeting – 01/11/99

MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Jurgensen to accept the minutes as submitted. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



Police Department Activity/Crime Statistic Report – 11/98

Park Commission Minutes – 11/11/98

Municipal Court Report – 12/98

MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to accept the correspondence for filing. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.



A. Bob Vitas, Town Administrator

Valley Gateway Development Project

Administrator Vitas updated the Board in regard to Valley Gateway’s progress with prospective retail clients.

Utility District Formation

Administrator Vitas updated the Board in reference to meetings held with the Town of Neenah and City of Appleton regarding the Town of Menasha’s utility district formation.

B. John Claypool, Town Attorney – No Report

C. Carlene Sprague, Town Clerk

Governmental Business Systems Service Agreement

Clerk Sprague asked for direction from the Board regarding a voting machine service agreement that recently had been made available by Governmental Business Systems. She stated that, in her opinion, if it’s not broken, why spend unnecessary money. The Board directed Clerk Sprague to not proceed.

2. Winnebago County Land Conservation Commitee

Clerk Sprague asked for direction from the Board in regards to whether the Board intended to seek a Resident to serve on an advisory committee to evaluate the Town’s current animal waste ordinance.

George Dearborn, Director of Community Development, stated that he will pursue this issue.

D. Town Board

Jeanne Krueger, Supervisor #1

Supervisor Krueger stated that back in October she made a telephone call to Dick Eiberger regarding the Town Board not serving on the Board of Review and had not received any response.

Clerk Sprague responded that Assessor Eiberger was in the Clerk’s office on January 25, 1999 to use the State Statutes to investigate this issue.

Supervisor Krueger stated that her point was that she brought it up in October of 1998 and it is now January 1999.

Robert Sprague, Supervisor #2 – Excused

Jerry Jurgensen, Supervisor #3

Supervisor Jurgensen stated that he had received a letter from Greg Fromm on his expectations regarding the completion of the Bridgeview Gardens Trailer Park berm. (See Attached)

Supervisor Jurgensen requested that George Dearborn and Administrator Vitas follow up on this.

Allen Nennig, Supervisor #4

Supervisor Nennig reported on a district meeting that will be held of the Wisconsin Town’s Association on March 13 in DePere at the Apple Creek Inn. He encouraged the Board members to attend.

E. Arden Tews, Town Chairman

Chairman Tews stated that it was time to get started on selecting candidates for nomination of Citizen and Business of the Year. He encouraged the Board to seek applicants.

F. Other Town Officials

Gaylene Nash, Assistant to the Administrator

Assistant Nash distributed the printing of the Town’s proposal folders, stationery, and envelopes regarding Community Development and Administration.

Mike Lettier, Police Commission President

Mike Lettier thanked the Town for allowing the Police Commission to install Crime Stoppers signs in the Town.



At 8:40 p.m., MOTION: Supervisor Nennig, second Supervisor Jurgensen to adjourn into closed session pursuant to 19.85(1)(g): Conferring with legal counsel for the governmental body who is rendering oral or written advice concerning strategy to be adopted by the body with respect to litigation in which it is or is likely to become involved and pursuant to 19.85(2), the Town Board may reconvene into open session to act on any business discussed in closed session. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.


ANNOUNCEMENTS – Same as on Agenda



At 9:37 p.m., MOTION: Supervisor Jurgensen, second Supervisor Nennig to adjourn the regular meeting of the Town Board of Supervisors. Motion carried unanimously, with Supervisor Sprague excused.

Respectfully submitted,



Carlene Sprague

Town Clerk